Mashable - The Social Media Guide - Latest Comments in Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

youtube downloader — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 04:13:05 -0000

I think google reader is much better now.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

tapirul — Mon, 05 Nov 2007 01:29:04 -0000

and so what?
who's the narcissist here? Your blood sugar drops if you don't get kilos of feed?

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Adam Hirsch — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 19:38:38 -0000

Hey Andrew... Completely agree with you. I said this above and I'll say it again:
Check out Marc Meyer, CEO of Activeweave BlogRovR's response to Pete's previous post:

http://mashable.com/2007/10/1 5/activeweave-blogrovr -screwy-feedburner-sta ts/

It's all about "Explicit Actions"

- Adam Hirsch, Mashable.com

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Andrew — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 04:37:55 -0000

I completely agree with what you have said. But not only that, as I was trying to delete all the feeds from my Google Reader account, was that it is immpossible to remove 2 or more feeds at once. I'm sure that people like me who sign up for Google Reader, and then add the feeds they read, and then move onto a different feed reader, they are probably still subscribed, even though they maybe reading it from another reader, thereby counting as two readers rather then just the one that they are.

It really is flawed, its a shame that there is no ONE accurate method of counting subscribers to a feed.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Troy — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 23:18:18 -0000

I'm hoping that the APML data being promoted by Newsgator and Bloglines can address this issue. If bloggers have a way of tracking APML data, it seems this would alleviate this issue. That's why I like the trends data in Google Reader. I can see where I spend my time, and unsubscribe from those feeds that I rarely read or are rarely updated.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Scott Lawton — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 21:37:48 -0000

Pete: great data but lousy conclusions. Surely you're aware of all the controversy over page views, and myriad problems with the Technorati 100, but every page on Mashable includes: "5 million monthly pageviews ... among the Top 100 blogs". (I have no objection at all; Mashable's rise is impressive and worth touting. But subscriber stats are also useful, even though flawed.)

More details in my post, plus followups with an interactive "long tail" chart and a first draft chart of Technorati vs. Google Reader data.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Adam Hirsch — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 18:34:29 -0000

First, thanks to Pete I think the world and word on "Footbag" just got a little more known. However, my confusion lies in between the footbag Sport, which seems to feature a net and team players versus the guy in the Modest Mouse video who is just a really talented hackey sack/footbagger?

- Adam Hirsch

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Eric — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 16:26:20 -0000

Ok, so I'm taking this kind of personally - sometimes it's more fun that way :).

I LOL when I read things like "sport of hacky sack, which is a bit of a joke sport even in the US" or "If I didn't know it existed, guarantee you 99% of Americans don't know it exists either."

Well, since you all are so confident that nobody knows or cares about footbag that you'd make such comments, I'm here to represent another person that does. The sport represents small community of enthusiastic athletes at all levels - beginner to the some of the best athletes in the world period. Footbag not being a main stream sport and with only the very best of the best, and with luck, making any real money at it - doesn't mean it's a joke. Just means *you* don't know about it.

So, I laugh - because I do that when someone speaks with such confidence about something they're so ignorant.

Again, I'm taking this kind of personally, obviously, so I've hardly acknowledged the main point - there are hardly 75K real subscribers to footbag.org's feed at Google's feed reader. I totally appreciate you calling this fact out - checking ad balancing the big guy. But footbag rocks :).

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Beast — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 11:29:57 -0000

Just for the record; footbag worldwide works for me. I can post pics if you like. Maybe you guys just don't know how to use google reader ;) ?

Also the reason footbag is included in the sports is because one of the main developers of the Google Reader is also a former footbag world champion (mixed doubles I think) and former director of the IFPA, as well as still being heavily involved.

I think it was one of those semi funny in jokes that google like, and also a bit of a thank you in including it.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

scooba — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 08:35:01 -0000

Excellent work, its good to see that im not the only one who sees the flaws in google.

Keep up the good work Pete.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

John Webber — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 07:53:47 -0000

Agreed. I am not able to access the footbag.org post right now, but I also have received updates from it in the past.

I did just check it and the feed seems to still be down. You can grab another great feed about footbag here: http://feeds.feedburner.com...

In reference to Adam's comment "If I didn't know it existed, guarantee you 99% of Americans don't know it exists either.", I would argue that footbag is gaining some serious traction in the US. Check out this recent Modest Mouse music vid (footbag featured throughout the entire movie): http://youtube.com/watch?v=...

...I'm sure Steve will see this post and get it fixed soon...I hope so for his sake :)

-john

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Footbag Lover — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 07:06:04 -0000

As a footbag player, I gotta say that I was taken aback by your description of it as a "joke". May I suggest that you edit your post to use "niche" instead? We'd thank you very much :)

As for why the (footbag) feed has so many subscribers: it's likely because it is included by default when you subscribe to the "Sports" package, along with EPSN.com.

My friend Steve runs footbag.org and happens to be the head manager for Reader. His engineers included the footbag.org feed into the pre-package as a show of support / joke.

Furthermore, as I'm sure you're aware, sometimes the best sites are not up 100% of the time. I would suggest that you simply caught the footbag feed at a bad time, as I've been getting regular updates from it (and recently at that), and it's working now to be sure.

I'm a big fan of this site (except when you dis my favorite sport ;)). Keep up the good work.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

BRIX — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 06:31:42 -0000

I appreciate content based opinion posts that are more than blurbs or asides. Thanks for this post. It was very helpful. I'm not suprised by the findings. I had a hunch about this some time ago.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Pete — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 05:37:54 -0000

Apologies to footbag players. No offence meant. Perhaps "niche" is a better word?

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Roy Klein — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 05:22:15 -0000

The footbag.org feed was actually working until at least a month ago, because for some time I was subscribed to it. Maybe the webmaster discontinued it, but I can vouch that when they added it to the subscription package it was a working feed.

And yes, hearing that a sport I participate in is a "joke sport" is not a fun experience, but I'm sure it was meant as a little funny anecdote rather than a serious remark. I'm aware that the serious side of footbag isn't very visible.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Steve — Tue, 16 Oct 2007 04:13:13 -0000

Pete, Nice analysis. It has been a while since you have done a post like this and it is good to see!

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Anne H — Mon, 15 Oct 2007 23:53:29 -0000

I think the area of RSS subscribers is similar to other stats that aren't easily validated or audited. Your analysis does indicate that people who are part of Google bundles do get a boost. You highlighted an issue pay may have missed.

I think until there is an agreed upon and verifiable measurement system, we'll have these issues. I don't think this problem is unique to Google or Feedburner. We've been seeing these type of issues in other unaudited entities such as Alexa for awhile.

And Edwin...that was a cool picture.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Cameron Chapman — Mon, 15 Oct 2007 22:56:30 -0000

I've found that their stats are off quite a bit even without taking bundling into account. When I check the Feedburner stats for one of my blogs it shows a number that is almost double what the Google Reader numbers are showing. This is with a very small number of subscribers overall, so it's easy to pick up and see what the discrepancies are. But it's definitely a significant difference.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Pete — Mon, 15 Oct 2007 22:28:27 -0000

OK, I'm adding the slight disclaimer that the TEDblog example may not be as clean cut as the others.

They emailed to say they have a total of 114K subs, of which 65,650 are on Google Reader. This means the Typepad feed has been consolidated into the Feedburner one, making it much harder to run the sums. Suffice to say, 60% of their subs are on Google Reader and only 40% are elsewhere: this is highly unusual and shows the powerful skewing effect of the default feed.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Beerzie — Mon, 15 Oct 2007 22:22:38 -0000

Hello, Beerzie from FILE here. A very interesting read. I had no idea that Google listed us having so many subscribers, and I too am always suspicious of ANY statistical analysis of subscribers/hits.

That being said, I have one comment you state that "This is a great boost for those sites that can get themselves listed in these bundles: often by striking a deal with the feedreader company or being friends with the owner." I want to go on the record -- because it may be of interest to your audience -- that we made no deliberate attempt to become part of Google's bundle (in fact, this is the first that I have become aware that such a thing existed.)

Moreover, we did not "strike a deal" with anyone in regards to our feeds. We offer the feed because it was easy to set up, and we thought people would like it. We are too technically inept and unconnected to do that, even if we wanted to.

Anyway, informative and interesting. Keep up the good work.

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Pete — Mon, 15 Oct 2007 22:20:33 -0000

Maybe people love footbag so much, they'll subscribe to a feed about it that doesn't currently exist just in case it suddenly starts existing again?

That's dedication to your sport. ;)

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Adam Hirsch — Mon, 15 Oct 2007 22:13:54 -0000

First, awesome picture! Second, I honestly as an American had no idea this sport existed. I mean, this is hackey sack with Volleyball rules. Absolutely Crazy! If I didn't know it existed, guarantee you 99% of Americans don't know it exists either. Quite sad, looks fun!

Either way, I don't think Pete was really putting down Footbag, he was just pointing out the irony that "the Footbag Worldwide feed does not exist", yet the subscribers were so high.

- Adam Hirsch, Mashable.com

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

notenking — Mon, 15 Oct 2007 22:10:18 -0000

Google is doing a foolish action...

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

Adam Hirsch — Mon, 15 Oct 2007 22:06:39 -0000

Great point Kevin. I think that there's a possibility this and similar posts will force more feed based companies to be a little more in depth in their count #s. Check out Marc Meyer, CEO of Activeweave BlogRovR's response to Pete's previous post:

http://mashable.com/2007/10...

Seems "explicit actions" are the way to go.

- Adam Hirsch, Mashable.com

Re: Google Reader Stats are Bullshit (With Proof)

edwin — Mon, 15 Oct 2007 21:47:43 -0000

Thanks for the analysis, but I don't see why you have to disparage footbag, which is a legitimate sport with thousands of active competitors worldwide.

Check out this pic I took at the 27th World Championships last year in Frankfurt, Germany:

http://www.flickr.com/photo...